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Michael Shellenberger is an investigative journalist and founder of Public, a Substack publication, founder and president of Environmental Progress, a research organization that incubates ideas,

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Joe sits down with Israel Adesanya, a mixed martial artist competing in the Middleweight division of the UFC. He is the subject of the documentary

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This episode is brought to you by BetterHelp. Get working on a better you with therapy. Visit http://BetterHelp.com/JRE today to get 10% off your first